Alpha Mesh recoloring glitches - RESOLVED

[IronBeard]

Really sorry, I posted this elsewhere in the wrong section in my haste.

Anyway, this seems to be the right spot. I have a problem with recolors of alpha mesh textures and would really appreciate any thoughts on the matter. It is probably easier to show you what I mean with screen shots, but I can't get any images to load on the page!

Basically I use a lot of alpha meshes in my game, many by Bloom. But very occasionally, with Sims wearing my recolors, the game glitches and the alpha textures black out. Everything slows down and even sound effects start to echo. As soon as I get the Sims to change into non-alpha outfits, everything goes back to normal again.

"Ah, it's your video card" I hear you say, and there may be some truth in that; the GMA950 was not the best choice Apple ever made, meaning I am one of those poor unfortunates with no fish in my fish tank!
However, I think the main problem is the way that the Mac version of BodyShop renders texture packages because any original texture packages I downloaded with the meshes work just fine; they never ever glitch.

Having made that discovery, I decided to transfer my outfit packages and their original graphics as PNG files to a Windows computer with SimPE installed. I used build DXT to replace the graphics in the packages and this solved the glitching problem when they were re-imported into my game. Great!

However, although the packages (and the game) are now stable, I have noticed a feint white edge, particularly on the 'hem line' of skirts that was not visible on the original BodyShop produced packages. This is only noticeable on short dark skirt textures, especially if the outfit includes dark leg cover (tights and stockings) or with darker skin tones.
I've tried replacing the alpha channel as well as the texture, but that didn't help.
I've tried saving a copy/saving as with SimPE and that didn't help either.
I've even tried clicking a few options that were a total mystery to me... yep, a waste of time!
Is there no way to get rid of that white hem line? Will I have to abandon all the short navy skirts I made for my schoolies, have them wear white instead?

[BlooM]

screeny?

[IronBeard]

Well, I couldn't get links to my iDisk to work here so I've opened a PhotoBucket a/c just for you!

This is how they look most of the time:

This is how the glitch appears:

This is with a non-glitching Bloom texture:

And this is the white line at the hem after build DXT:


I hope it's a bit clearer what I mean.

[BlooM]

with the glitches you mean the outfit becomming completly black?
No idea why that happens....

The white line at the hem is the layer alpha(white) exceeding the texture itself i think.

If you build new textures then use DXT3 or DXT5, not DXT1.
DXT1 doesn't support transparancy wich could cause the outfits becomming black.

[IronBeard]

Thank you for replying, Bloom.

with the glitches you mean the outfit becomming completly black?
No idea why that happens....

No, but I know when it's likely to occur: if my computer has been busy for any length of time with image/video applications, or after using a media server or BitTorrent client - anything using a background daemon. I've long since developed the habit of rebooting before I play TS2 which has reduced the frequency of glitches. In fact, in order to test the stability of my SimPE edits, it took me three days to induce a glitch, which I did by having CS3 Bridge scan a large folder of images in the background while I ran the game.

The white line at the hem is the layer alpha(white) exceeding the texture itself i think.

That seems logical. However, I am always very careful to produce a clipping mask from the exact same texture I am using, and rebuilding the alpha channel in SimPE made no difference at all. I even tried increasing the length of the texture image by a couple of pixels and leaving the alpha as it was, but that white line was still there.

If you build new textures then use DXT3 or DXT5, not DXT1.
DXT1 doesn't support transparancy wich could cause the outfits becomming black.

I've no idea how BodyShop builds these textures, they look great but they glitch. All of my edits in SimPE are done DXT5, they don't glitch and most look great. It's just these short, very dark items that show the white line.
But I have noticed that some darkish skirts of a similar length show no trace of white edging at all. Notice that neither the fringed skirt or the denim one are affected, though they were built DXT5, just like the navy skirt on the right which does have the white edge (it looks 10 times worse in the game!).

So I wonder if it is something to do with the texture itself, that irregular edges or a busy surface texture work better. Maybe the edge pixels on the dark skirt line up in such a way that it fools SimPE into treating them as part of the alpha... thus the white edging is actually part of the mesh not picking up the texture, if that makes sense.
I must admit, I'm floundering in the dark a bit here, so I shall just have to keep on re-working the packages until something clicks.

[Theraven]

What is/was the background color on the dark skirt? If it is white, then it's probably just some uncolored pixles. Try to color a good-sized part around the texture in the same color the skirt is. I've had a similar problem with some alphas that made black or white linings show until I colored everything around that particular area on the texture.

Alpha clothes with transparency needs more work out of your graphics card, and graphic glitches are bound to happen when your graphic card is overworked.
I don't have that particular problem, but I know that on certain lots in my game, things start flashing purple when my graphic card/memory card is overworked (or when Vista finds it fun to bug me). Not sure if it's textures or rendering polys, or maybe a combination. The game is very resource demanding, and Vista tends to crash it to desktop when it consumes memory over 3GB (the usual is 2GB, but I did a 3GB fix on that one. Only happens on my heaviest lots now).

The best thing you can do, is to reduce number of alpha clothes used on a lot, and try not to use background applications while running the game.

I tend to lay down the game (hit start button OR alt+tab), open up photoshop/whatever, do what I'm supposed to do, close down the program, and open up the game again.

Oh, and DXT3 is usually more than enough. DXT5 is mostly used for shadows. Not sure if it's a size difference on the file between DXT3 and 5, but there is a size difference between DXT1 and 3.

[IronBeard]

What is/was the background color on the dark skirt? If it is white, then it's probably just some uncolored pixles. Try to color a good-sized part around the texture in the same color the skirt is... etc.

I thought that the background might be the issue; generally, I follow the Maxis way and use a hue from the texture item. But I've tried that, and I've tried white, black and 50% grey too but the problem persists. As a workaround, I've created a new skirt for my schoolies similar to the default for private school and banded it off-white around the hem. That is fine, no white line!
I was observing a bunch of schoolgirls on the train on my way home this evening, they were wearing navy skirts and it struck me how crappy they look with that greasy sheen from sitting for hours on plastic seats and too many Big Mac lunches. Maybe I'm just sick of navy skirts in general, I certainly won't be creating any more for my sims!
As for glitching, as long as I re-build my package textures in SimPE, it doesn't happen, ONLY straight from BodyShop alpha items are affected.
I tried  both DXT3 and 5, but could see no difference. I'll probably stick with 5, being greedy for high numbers.
But thanks for taking the trouble to reply.

[BlooM]

Could you upload the problem skirt?

[IronBeard]

Could you upload the problem skirt?

I could do, where to? Do you mean straight from BodyShop or one that's been edited in SimPE?

[BlooM]

One that causes problems ingame.
And the name of the mesh i need to install to make the outfit work.

[caffeinated.joy]

Upload it to a file hosting site (MediaFire, Rapidshare, or whatever one you like) and post a link to it in here.

[IronBeard]

Suddenly inspired, I just had to try something before we leave for a long weekend break, much to my wife's annoyance, but -

Eureka! Hand me a towel. I'm either very stupid or a genius, but I've solved the white hem line problem.
I had been using my original PhotoShop outfit templates to produce the PNG files for building DXT in SimPE. It suddenly occurred to me that I should try exporting a texture directly from a package in SimPE and using it to re-build DXT. No doubt this would have been obvious to a seasoned SimPE user!
Whatever, it seems to have worked and the white line is gone. The odd thing is that the PNG texture exported in SimPE overlays and aligns with my original texture perfectly, so I still don't know why it rendered differently.

Anyway, thanks for all your input.
I'm off to get some country air and drink a lot!

[BlooM]

If you save your new build png you choose ''save for web'' (in PS that is)
Save it as 24bit

[IronBeard]

Thank you, Bloom. I didn't know that and will give it a try next time I need to re-build a texture. Isn't this fun!