Insimenator.org

Update:
Remapped the feet on the uvmap to make it a bit easier for skinners.
Added male feet.


Note:
This thread is only for mesher's who like to add the feet to their meshes
UPDATED INFO, PLZ PLZ use the setup as i described!!!!!

Altho i had alot of work on them before i had the feet work properly in the game i thought its only fair i share.
The files are in Simpe format and you can import them in Milkshape using Unimesh
And before some peeps start messing arround with them here are some tips:
*Import your mesh
*import the sexy feet
*look were calves and knees join
*hide the feet
*cutt of the Maxis feet and calves from the body/fatmorph and if there, the pregmorph.
*Place the feet on top of the grouplist
*export your file(this will take 2 seconds longer as normal ;) )

The file is already named body, if you attache them to a bottom rename the body to bottom in the comment box of the feet.(and if you like, the groupname, but not necesarry)
The vertexpositions and normals on the join are identical to maxis default so if you didn't change those on your mesh you wont have to fix that part.(you might wanna check tho ;) )
The body and morphs use the same feetgroup, this to reduce the packagesize.
So dont regroup the feet with your body or bottom group if its not necessary
After peeps asking why not to regroup and attache the feet to the morph's:
By keeping the feet a single group with no morph's attached it will be alway's visible, in normal/fit/fat and pregnant state.
Its the best setup you should use, cuts down on the polygon's and diskspace, avoiding lagprobs and longer loading time
You will create a unnecesarry large file wich only can cause problems if you do diffrent.
This setup is not designed by, some maxis outfits use this setup and works alot better!!!!!
If the calves are diffrent on the morphs just cut of the topcalves of the feetgroup, use the same setup as i described above, plz do!!!!!
And plz ask me if you need help with them, ill be happy to help in any way!
There will be a visible join on darker skintones!!!!
I would like to see the post if you release the mesh and give some credit. ;)
You might wanna add to your post that your mesh has ALOT of polygons.
Thnx and have some fun with them :D

(http://www.insimenator.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=83878&stc=1&d=1184488464)

Thanks for making these available to the meshers out there. Although I'm not one myself (one day, maybe), I hope to see these beauties on more of the popular meshes out there.

Just might cut down on your "requests" too, eh? ;)



I believe there's a method to your madness...:shh:

Very nice doll!

Nice Job

Oh thank you! I was waiting for this ^^

Wish I could mesh, because these look fantastic in game. I'd LOVE to see them on lots of meshes.

I hope to see these on alot more sims.

Also just letting you know. These feet work fine for me and I have one of the worst computers for the sims 2. My computer just meets the bare minimum for running the sims 2 except my computer is incompatable with direct X. But these wonderful feet work just fine :).

Lol, cant believe wat im hearing.....

Thanks for these Bloom, please don't hit me, but could we group the feet witht the body and just have the feet and the body as one whole, and do this for the other morphs as well or no??:)

I strongly advise you not to do that as you will need 3 set of feet in your gmdc file.
I edit my post after you asked, because i already see alot of peeps messing up :(
You can cut of a part of the calves on the feetgroup if calves are diffrent on the calves of your original mesh.
By keeping the feet a single group with no morph's attached it will be alway's visible, in normal/fit/fat and pregnant state.
Its the best setup you should use, cuts down on the polygon's and diskspace, avoiding lagprobs and longer loading time!!
Plz, ask me hundred times, i dont care!!!
Ill try to help anyway i can
The feet are performing very well with this setup, i cant garantee they will with a diffrent setup.

At last...nice feets for our sims. I hope to see them soon so from meshers out there so they can be the feets of my sims. That maxis feets sucks, so I`m waiting.

Thank you. Nice work.

Ok, thanks Bloom for the help and for these terrific feet, I don't know how you do it and I thank you so much!!!!!:)

Bloom,

Once more I'm very impressed, not only by your creativity and the quality of your work, but also by your understanding of the whole meshing thing.

Thank you very much for sharing  :)

Thank you so much Marvine!!!
I know there are alot good meshers arround but i just know a few.
Your on top of that list and you saying this to me, makes me feel proud.
Thank you so much again!! :)

I hate to be a naysayer, but doesn't using Poser 7 content violent the Efrontier P7 EULA? I read it and it states you may noy use any of their content. :(

They do look really good on the Sims meshes I have seen however.

http://www.e-frontier.com/article/view/2084/1/881/

Got to find out, thnx for the info
People pay 250 dollar for a proggy and you cant use any of the stuff? :(

I know its a bit sucky :( I feel bad... But I'd feel worse if EFrontier came down on Insim & yourself.

EFrontier has no grounds to object to Bloom's meshes, or even any reason to want to try.  Heck, they're even polite enough to acknowledge the primacy of copyright law in their EULA:

   D. You cannot sell, resell, distribute, cause to be distributed, or allow any portion of the Restricted Content to be distributed under any circumstances, via any public or private medium, except where expressly permitted by this EULA and US copyright law. . .

Might look a bit scary, but the key phrase is actually "expressly permitted by . . . US copyright law".  Copyright law exists to prevent commercial sale of somebody else's commercial work.  Its goal is to forbid large scale, outright, and blatant theft that profits the thief.  Hence, just because something is under copyright does not mean no part of it may be used under any circumstances.

There is a four part test for whether or not something is considered "fair use":

1. Purpose and character of use. Bloom is not selling anything; he's giving his work away for people's own private use.  Putting up a mesh is a clear example of a thing whose purpose is to "stimulate creativity for the enrichment of the general public"; he's providing a tool.  Having Bloom's meshes does not "supersede the objects" of Poser 7-- which is to say, having Bloom's meshes is in no significant way a substitute for having Poser 7.

2. Nature of the copied work.  Irrelevant here; nobody is arguing that Poser 7's feet by its nature have to be in the public domain-- they have no great educational value, are not historic documents, etcetera.

3. Amount and substantiality.  Only a miniscule fraction of the data from the Poser 7 distribution appears in Bloom's meshes.  Nor are the feet the most important part of Poser 7; nobody could argue that there are hordes of people wanting to buy Poser 7 because they really, really want the feet.

4. Effect upon work's value.  No sane lawyer would try to convince a judge that Bloom's meshes being available measurably decrease the value of Poser 7.  Indeed, one could argue that this whole thing increases Poser 7's value-- on public relations grounds alone.


Wikipedia's article on "fair use" is readable, but of course it was witten by a nebulous cloud of people.  Fortunately, one Terry Carroll-- who teaches intellectual property law-- maintains a FAQ that's still quite understandable by laymen:
http://www.tjc.com/copyright/FAQ/
Of particular relevance:
http://www.tjc.com/copyright/FAQ/CFAQ02.html#2.8
http://www.tjc.com/copyright/FAQ/CFAQ02.html#2.9

Never the less ;)
I wait on EFrontier reaction on this post as i mailed it to them.

Good luck.
It's beautiful mesh and it would be a shame if all your hard work on this cannot be shared with others of the Sims2 community.

Hmm, I kinda wondered about this too, which is also partly why I went with a really old set of meshes for mine... nobody's gonna care about 10-year-old low-poly feet.  I think they'll be reasonable though, I mean folks sell all kinds of stuff that is based on the Poser meshes in some way or another over at Renderosity, although they don't distribute the meshes... but you're not either, just a small part of the raw vertex data, and it's been altered significantly.  We'll have to see how they respond, I guess.  Damn Intellectual Property laws are just ridiculous anyway...

How they respond will not change the fact that it remains fair use.  Note too that EFrontier has little or nothing to gain by saying "yes", and at least potentially has something to lose,  At a minimum, answering "yes" constitutes amending their agreement between Bloom and EFrontier, which has legal implications.  This would have to be formally vetted by their lawyers to make sure they don't accidentally weaken their own copyright claims-- and lawyers are not free.  Ergo, I know which way I'm betting their response will go...  (I'd also give it a 50% chance they suggest that people who want to use the feet in their own games may of course do so-- as long as they've bought a full copy of Poser 7.)



There are problems, yes-- particularly after the passage of the The Copyright Term Extension Act of 1998-- but what organizations like the RIAA claim the law implies are, at best, self-serving.  They tend not to stand up in court.

Excellent posts, szielins, you've obviously done some serious homework. I spent considerable time reading the EULA yesterday from the link that was provided in another post, and will peruse these links as well ~ just 'cause I'm a nosy son-of-a-gun...

BlooM, we here in the Sim Community wish you a speedy response from EFrontier on this matter, the feet you worked so hard to bring us demands no less...

(http://www.insimenator.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=85120&stc=1&d=1185127650)

Thnx guy's
HWT, the link you gave me with the other feet........
They are exactly the same lol

So, just say you used those, and let whoever uploaded them worry about it... :laugh:

Lol, wish i knew earlier, i might have done that. :D
The same feet are on a few sites, cant imagine peeps only use them for their own games.

So from what szeilins is saying they may tell BlooM he can't distribute the altered feet in any mesh because they'd have to pay a lawyer to draw up the paperwork to give him permission in a way that won't open a legal can of worms?  Just proves Shakespeare was right.

It would be cheaper if they had a "don't ask, don't tell" policy as long as no one resells their work.  

I'm positive that most lawyers were not taught to share as children

I hope szielins' educated guess about their response is wrong.  
Bloom, you've made a noteworthy improvement on the Sims front and I'm going to selfishly say now I'm really glad I downloaded the sexy feet Sims before this happened (because I'm just that shallow ;).  
One good thing, based on the way you handled it, going to them on your own when you found out there might be a problem, they have no motivation to do worse than say no.

While you're waiting you could always work on readying the CPU curvy bits for animation ;)  At least we know Wes H will never say no to Sim modders.

EFrontier didn't ask; they did not come looking for this problem.  But things change when a specific person asks THEM, "Is it okay if I do this specific thing with your stuff?"  Inevitably, they have to wonder, "Wait... is this fellow planning to do something with our stuff that ISN'T fair use?  After all, he doesn't HAVE to ask to ask our permission for fair use-- indeed, we coudn't stop him even if we wanted to.  What's actually going on, here?"  Of course they're going to get nervous, and flag it as, "Better not say yes unless the lawyers say it's okay; something fishy may be going on."  (A cheaper alternative is to say, "We can't say yes unless Legal blesses it, and they're a bit backlogged; we'll get back to you soon," and then pigeonhole it.  A sneakier alternative is to silently pigeonhole it.)

Bear in mind that it was a gravely flawed misreading of the EULA that led to the concern in the first place.  EFrontier almost certainly didn't know BlooM or his meshes from a crate of tinned stoat giblet soup before he initiated contact with them-- and had some random third party just mailed them the URL, they almost certainly would have said, "So what?  He's not reselling Poser 7, he's giving away an add-on useful only for a specific game."

At the risk of becoming a bit preachy, this is one reason why artists really should be familiar with copyright law.  Very few things are truly de novo-- but there are real reasons why (for instance) Warhol could not only produce but also sell prints of Campbell's soup cans perfectly legally, totally without regard for whether the Campbell's people happened to approve or not.

O my, O my, you do have a way with words ;)
I had a message they forwarded it to their legal department, guess it will take a while before they respond ;)

Eh.  Experience is a long list of things you'll never do again.  :)

Did you promise to keep the meshes down unless they explicitly said it was okay to put them back up?

Just to make all the people who missed the sexy feet jealous:
(http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s159/miros1/Assorted/FamilyBathroom.jpg)
Yes, mom is wearing the default nude bottom with the sexy feet...

My english aint the best but this is the exact text i mailed to Efrontier:

Nothing there but an earnest of good faith and a request for clarification on what they think they're trying to allow and disallow with the EULA.  For their part, they've forwarded it off to the right people to generate an answer eventually, and did not include a request that you keep them down until they get back to you.  I see little reason why the meshes couldn't go back up while they're trying to reach a decision; if the issue is important to them, an answer will come back quickly, and if the issue isn't important to them and/or it's item #7365 on Legal's list of Things That Have To Be Addressed Someday, Eventually, If We Have Time (as is almost certainly the case), might as well leave them up in the interim.  (Noting, of course, that I am not a lawyer and it isn't my name on the things... On the other hand, I already have copies, so I'm not putting the idea out there for my benefit, either.)

EFrontier's intellectual property people are FAR more concerned about full blown outright theft-- there are people out there duplicating the entire Poser 7 distribution and selling it.  You're not one of those people, and could not be mistaken for one.  A clear case of fair use, a small number of people making use of the stuff from a site that can only be considered "obscure" in the greater scheme of things, and the guy doing it is in a different country-- arguing it down to the wire would be a big headache for no real gain, and that they do not need.

If i only had some time, i would build some feet from scratch.....
Dont know wat to do really, just wait another week orso.
I know alot of peeps already have the meshes so there wont be much diffrence if i keep it this way or put them up for downloading again.
If there's any harm(?) its already done..
Ill put the meshes back up next week, except the ones in this thread i think.

Well it seems to me your intentions were pretty clear, BlooM. You were creating something for people to enjoy using a tool that EF developed, which I think were their intentions when they developed the Poser series. I think warlokk had a valid point when he stated that he purposely used an older set for his little project, thought being that EF probably would care to a lesser degree that he was using them for no monetary gain (same as you), and that they were more readily available from sources outside of EF. Interesting to me yet is the fact that the legs/feet that I linked to in another post appear to have been extracted from Poser7. It would be interesting to see what the person(s) who made those available might have to say (if anything) regarding EF's policy, if at all posible.

Why?  And to what policy, exactly, are you referring to?

Well, i cant be bothered anymore.
This is the Post Hardwaretoad is referring to and were i downloaded them(the ones that are now on my meshes)
http://artist-3d.com/free_3d_models/dnm/model_disp.php?uid=115&ad=02anatomy_design.php&count=count (http://artist-3d.com/free_3d_models/dnm/model_disp.php?uid=115&ad=02anatomy_design.php&count=count)
I did rebuild them using direct x tool to reduce the poly's, gave them new bones etc etc.

And you know wat? The legs/calve and feet were identical as the ones that are in Poser.
So i dont know who copied who :lol:
Or is 3d studio from the same company?
These are their terms of use, didn't violated any of those did i?


Lol, and look at these POSER GOODIES (http://www.planit3d.com/source/poser/poser.html)........ its all up for free and i am worried?

How much will it take to convince Bloom to upload male feet meshes? This whole feet copyrights issue is turning into a bad soap opera. What the heck made bloom contact Efrontier in 1st place, regret? Hey, Efrontier you're violating the copyrights of my feet and also those of 6 billion people more, should I sue you?

It's not always clear what the law is, particularly when EULAs come in, and organizations such as the RIAA have been deliberately spreading fear, uncertainty, and doubt as to what is likely to happen should one inadvertently slip up.  There's an argument to be made for erring on the side of caution-- and more importantly, all's well that ends well.



There's no such thing.  An image of your feet can be copyrighted, but it's the photographer or painter who owns it.  The numeric representation of your feet expressed in polygon vertexes can be copyrighted, but the data then belongs to the digitizer.  Just because you walk around on the things gives you no particular rights...  Incidentally, in the USA and places with similar laws, the same thing applies to your face-- at least when you're in public.  If a photographer happens to shoot me bumbling down the street with my usual moronic expression and then sells a print to a silly-picture collector for a hundred dollars, I have no particular claim against either of them.  (The rules change when advertising or other forms of deliberate mass broadcast become involved, though.)

It's also worth renoting that EFrontier not only hasn't threatened to sue anybody, there's no reason to believe they want to.

Oh thank you!Oh thank you!Oh thank you!

Thanks these will be usefull and handy Thanks again Rated Excellent an 5*'s WOW!!!!

You completely rock! Thank you!

yes, these feet you import in milkshape.
The bodymeshes you have to extract from the game.
Meshing is a lot of studying and reading tutorials, start here:
http://www.modthesims2.com/forumdisplay.php?f=445 (http://www.modthesims2.com/forumdisplay.php?f=445)

I hope it's not been too long to post in this thread but I didn't really see the point in starting a new one...

Anyway, I added your lovely sexy feet to a mesh but I had to move the mapping on the left side because there was already something there. Understandably the texture isn't right on that foot, but I'm not sure how to make the texture show up correctly. I mean, where it's originally mapped on a skintone it's basically flat color there, so I don't really understand where the toe highlights are coming from.

Open the BMP uvmap i posted in this thread and you see that the toenails are mapped in the middle.
If you open the mesh in Milkshape and assigne a material to it you can view the uvmap.
Then you can decide if you like to move the parts.
I have a few difrent setups of the uvmap, i used those on more complicated meshes were there wasn't any space left on the original spot(like in your case)
But you need to view them in Milkshape/uvmap to decide wich one to pick or how to solve your problem.
I did included 2 female feet meshes, one with both feet mapped on the left side and one mapped with them on the right side.
The toenails are mapped on the same spot as the fingernails, so no worries about those!
Just use one of those if you can not figure it out. :)

You could probably also remap the parts that "are already there", and fix the texture afterwards, so that the mesh will work with the skintones :)

Yup, also possible.
I never had that choice with the replacements as i needed to update all the outfit texture files...

I can't really do that, unfortunately. This mesh is a replacement to add morphs so if I did that I'd have to go and change all their recolors as well =/

Thanks for the new mappings, Bloom. I'll mess around with those in a few :)

ETA:
The texture looks much better on my mesh but the mapping for the toenails were completely gone when I imported it into milkshape. Also, there are cracks galore up the back of one heel and down across the foot by the toes, none of which showed up in milkshape. I tried combining the old and new together (in attempt to save myself more vertex movement) and the toenails didn't get carried over. No idea why o.O

Anyway, I'm going to keep poking at it.

Oh, i am srry....those cracks are a result of mirrored uv parts and i thought i fixed those......
Well, i did fix them on the meshes i used them on but i have to have a look wich ones....
I know for sure AL sexyfeetmesh is fixed, did that recently:
http://www.insimenator.org/index.php/topic,96042.0.html
However, its a male mesh and has the nails mapped on the fingers(like the previous is uploaded.)


Here is another one i ran into, its a female with one set of feet mapped on the left, also the nails are mapped on the fingers.
The nails however you can easily place back to their original spot tho.

Another one i mirrored and is fixed is the Female ''afbodypajamaslong'' from Glamour EP
http://www.insimenator.org/index.php/topic,70301.0.html
But it also has the nails moved to the fingers


Wich mesh are you updating?

I tried the male mesh and had the same problem with the gaps but I'll try the female one. It looks like less editing at least.

The mesh I am editing is this (http://www.digitalperversion.net/gardenofshadows/index.php?topic=3865.0) one, at GOS. I already add the morphs to it but someone requested a sexy feet version.

Here, seen the mesh
This one should work unless they textured unnecesarry space on the alpha, then you have a problem...

I think it's official that your feet hate me. I don't know what it is, but every single remapped one I tried has those gaps (the worst being up the heel on the left foot) when I test it in game. It's not like I touch that area, nor around the top of the toes. I tried merging the normals and it doesn't do anything.

I know you said it happens when you mirror the uv but I thought what you do in there doesn't even bother with the actual mesh vertices?

Do you mind if I ask how you're horizontally flipping that part of the uvmap? I can't see it as an option with milkshape... do you use something else?

The gaps are a result of using a external uvmapper.
If you save your mesh as a ms3d file you can open it with LithUnwrap.
In LithUnwrap you can mirror parts, then export the file as *.luv format.
Back in Milkshape you can import the edited *.luv uvmap (lithium unwrapper uv)

Unfortunate this will mess up the mesh badly with gaps wich you have to fix.....
Those errors can be fixed by snapping those vertices back together even when all looks ok in Milkshape.(also check the boneassignements on those problem areas.
But the file i uploaded in my previous post should be fixed already as i uploaded it as a replacement for the Glamour sexyfeet replacements, not?
If not then you need to download the adult female Pj from the Glamour EP and extract the mesh.
Make sure to get the correct files, i remember messing up many times with identical files and attempts..:(

If you got sick and tired of it, upload your mesh and outfit so i can have a look

Ah. I saved it differently in lithunwrap but it mangled it up pretty badly. I'm not just talking gaps, everything got extremely jagged. I couldn't seem to smooth them at all. Either way, I tried to close the gaps in the last one you gave me as well as the others and they wouldn't close. I've tried them all that you linked me to.

I'll keep trying though. Thank you so much for taking the time to help me. I'll definitely keep that offer in mind.

eh? The last one doesn't have gaps, i already fixed and uploaded them a year ago(Glamour EP)

I'm talking about the one you uploaded to post #50 in this thread. But yeah, they all had gaps. So I don't know, maybe I'm doing something wrong... even though I didn't touch those areas initially. I really don't know =/

crap, you were right....i am sorry!!
I really messed things up on those........spent one hour to fix it. :(
Should be ok now  :-X
You only need to import your morphs, ;)

Oh my god, I love you! 3yay
It works perfectly! Again, thank you SO much for helping me with this, I'm sure it must have gotten a bit annoying at times!

I have one last question, though. Does the foot group have to keep the body name or could I rename it to feet? How does the game not confuse the parts?

You keep it the same name(body)
Basegame meshes are all build out of a top/bottom or body, few exeptions(transparant nighty/vampire outfit and a few others)
In your outfit you find the propertyset wich links the textures to the mesh.(overrides)
I advise this as the feet are a high polygon mesh, duplicating it 2 times for the fat and pregnant morphs makes it a huge file.....better not!! ;)
By keeping it a seperate group meshgroup it will be always there, even when a sim is changing to fat or pregnant.
You do need to cut off all existing old blockfeet from the morphs tho, otherwise you get a error(mismatch in ammount of vertices)

In my outfits i added lines in the propertyset for shoes/alphalayers or parts that needed reflectivity.
By doing this the new texturefiles bodyshop extracts (when cloning a outfit) are also getting those new names, maybe that confused you.

Glad this is working :)

Edit,
Deleting your meshfile