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Author Topic: Paysite Discussion Thread  (Read 75046 times)
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Tenshii~Akari
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« Reply #225 on: August 14, 2007, 09:00:23 am »

:lol:  Really sounds that way, doesn't it?  Especially from the way I said my piece above...

Quote from: kathy;880728
... Bottom line people are going to do what they want with zero regard for anyone other than themselves. They don't want to pay for content so by god they will find a new excuse not to and on the same token well since it's legal lets milk this cow for all it's worth.

And I couldn't agree more with that part.  It's always going to be that way with anything people do.
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Dr_Pixel
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« Reply #226 on: August 14, 2007, 01:14:14 pm »

Not surprisingly, Maxis/EA is saying "We don't have a problem with paysites, stop bothering us about it."

What this does is put to rest any arguments that paysites are somehow illegal.

Will it stop the pirates?  Certainly not, but I must admit I find it funny to see everyone who used to treat the EULA as if it was the Holy Grail suddenly doing a complete 180...
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Inge Jones
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« Reply #227 on: August 14, 2007, 01:25:21 pm »

Quote from: Dr_Pixel;881096
I find it funny to see everyone who used to treat the EULA as if it was the Holy Grail suddenly doing a complete 180...


Yes, it's interesting.
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« Reply #228 on: August 14, 2007, 01:57:04 pm »

You know, I couldn't agree more with you guys. I asked a question on The Simsfilevault, why is it okay to respect the wishes of free creators and not pay creators? I had a couple of great responses, such as want to respect the free creators because maybe they will keep their content free. True enough for me, BUT, if the EULA is changing then the people there will be guilty of the same thing they accused paysites of doing, stealing. I was actually convinced because I actually read the first EULA myself so that was my proof but now that EA is saying it's okay then that gives me nor anyone else the right to fight so hard against paysites and bring the legal mumbo jumbo in the argument and then when the other side wins it's like well I won't accept my loss. I will do what I want because this is supposed to be a "friendly" community. Well, if these people thought that way then why not respect all creators? Paying for stuff isn't undermining fun in the sims community. If you want to pay then pay, if not you should obtain your cc legally since that was the whole argument anyway right?
« Last Edit: August 14, 2007, 01:58:41 pm by SolidGoldFunk » Logged

Dr_Pixel
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« Reply #229 on: August 14, 2007, 04:20:50 pm »

Judging from the responses I have seen on the threads on S2C, for many anti-paysite people it was obviously not really the argument, nor anything they really cared about anyway.  It was just a convienient way to make themselves look legitimate, as if they were upholding the law, and protecting the "community".  The truth is coming out now.
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Tenshii~Akari
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« Reply #230 on: August 14, 2007, 08:33:06 pm »

(I know, I'm really, really random with posting in this topic sometimes, but I just had to get this 'little' tidbit on how the outside world sees us simmers and the issue of pay vs. free content.)

I decided to get an opinion from a few "non-biased" sources today... or just three people who don't know about the online Sims community, just to be fair.

I just had an interesting conversation with my older brother on this subject a few hours ago.  (a heavy gamer)  He's played The Sims before, but hasn't touched a Sims game since the original came out... and even then he didn't play it that much, nor did he know about custom content and paysites.  As soon as I brought up the subject about the paysite debate on the web, of course he did a double take.  His reaction was just about the same as mine when I first found out about them...

"People actually pay for that stuff?  Pssh.  Goes to show how far people will go just to put money in their pockets..."  

He also said that any game company that doesn't give a care about who's selling what parts of their game code is "just plain stupid."  (:dontknow: This is actually a debatable statement.  I think it was a genius move, because if they didn't have a tight reign on their DBPF ".package" file format coding, there wouldn't be all the decent game fixes, cool mods, and helpful development tools made by the community.  Personally, I think if they just come out with a more noticeable official statement, then some people won't have to question their business sense like he did.)

Then I asked a friend of mine from school earlier today.  Unlike my brother, he plays sims, but he doesn't know anything outside of the official site, or too much on custom content at that.  When he asked me about all of the different clothes, objects, etc. I had in my game, I gave props to here, MTS2, and other free sites.  Then I asked him how would he feel if he found out he had to pay for some of the stuff he was pining for from my game.  He looked at me, laughed, and said, "You're kidding me, right?  I don't need all that stuff that badly."  Of course, I took the time to tell him that people actually did that, and needless to say, he was just as surprised as my brother.  (Especially after he checked out PeggySims2 for the first time.  I think he almost had heart palpitations when he saw the subscription prices.  :lol: )

Lastly, I asked the person who knows the least about games:  my mom.  :smile bi:  Simply put:  she thinks we're all a bunch of nuts and fanatics... and that we should be doing something more productive in life other than sitting at the computer and "screamin' back 'n forth" about what's supposed to be done with a game.    And that's the nicer version of it... :roll:

These people think we're Class A weird.  :eh:  Oh well...

~~~~~~~~~~~~

Now, getting back to the original topic:


I can't really speak for everyone, but I think the "protecting the community" claim is still legit enough for me.  Well... not so much as protecting, but "shedding light on the shadowy spots" would probably be more like it.  I actually have to thank the ones who started the in-your-face approach.  I would've never known all of the good and bad points of what's happening in the community if it wasn't for them.  With more and more people learning about both sides of the issue every day, I think that should still count for anti-paysite believers speaking out more openly, and sites like InSim, MTS2, and PMBD allowing it.  

And in a small defense:  some people still do care about the overall Sims community.  Not everyone should be categorized as self-righteous  just because they change their opinion on the EULA and legal rights, but not on file sharing.  No accusations here... just needed to get that off my chest.  I know someone out there reading this and the other threads had to be thinking that.   Wink
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SolidGoldFunk
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« Reply #231 on: August 15, 2007, 01:29:12 am »

Yeah, I have to admit that I thought you guys were being self-righteous. It just doesn't seem fair to bring EA into this and then when they do something about it, criticize them for it. All is supposed to be friendly here right? So why not make the change now and stop arguing about who's right and who's wrong. Let's just respect everyone whether you like them or not. This should not turn into anything more than it has to. If PMBD wants to stay up and you want to raid it then by all means but wouldn't that be hypocritical to do? I don't think that protecting the community is a valid point. If you want stuff that bad then you're gonna pay for it. Obviously not too many people had or has a problem with paysites since people were buying from places like Peggysims2. So let people do their own thing and enjoy the freakin' game! That will "protect" the community in the long run, IMHO. So let's all hug now:group hu:
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PegasusDiana
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« Reply #232 on: August 15, 2007, 07:13:17 am »

Ok like an idiot I downloaded home crafter plus just to see what the thingy says and here is how it reads, I had to delete the old one first to get the new one to install: I have a serious question at the end of this for any paysite owner or those cheering saying EA is going to support paysites to please give me an honest answer.

It's a lot different then the content manager one. Your all welcome to go and download it, it can be found on the website. I think it's like the other guy told me it's because you can't create CC with the Content Manager. But this is neither here nor there. EA is allowing discussions on paysites to be allowed on the BBS now. They know there are paysites, they know about the Pirate site. They know people are uploading paid content to the BBS. They haven't done a thing for either side. So both sides of the coin are just batting in the wind. EA doesn't want to dirty their hands and alienate either side to loose fans. We can argue day and night but it isn't going to solve this issue. Spore won't come with anyway to sell CC and neither will Sims 3 we already know this. Both programs are going to come with CC makers, but you won't be able to sell the CC. The difference? EA is going in from the beginning in both Spore and Sims 3. They came in on the tail end of Sims 2 and owning "all" rights. How long before it comes out?  Not long at all. Smiley Just go to a show and you'll see how CC will be handled for the games. Oh and when your there ask Will what he thinks about paysites, and how he's boosom buddies with any fansite owner that goes or is invited to the shows. That's all I'm going to say on this matter. I've called EA legal more than once, and now I've gone to a one night show that cost too much money just to be told the same thing I have been told all along. I'm done. People are going to twist the EULA to suit their needs on both sides. So there is no sense in arguing it anymore.

EA TOOLS & MATERIALS END USER LICENSE
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Electronic Arts Inc, and its subsidiaries, affiliates and licensors (collectively, "EA") grants you a non- transferable non-exclusive license to download and/or install and use one copy of the software tool ("Tool") and/or materials ("Materials") (collectively the "Tools & Materials") solely for your personal noncommercial use in connection with EA’s products, in accordance with the terms below.

EA owns all of the rights, title and interest in the Tools & Materials. You may not alter any of EA's trademarks or logos, or alter or remove any of EA's trademark or copyright notices included in or with the Tools & Materials or EA's products. Your right to use Tools & Materials is limited to the license grant above, and you may not otherwise copy, display, distribute, perform, publish, modify, create works from, or use any of the Tools & Materials.  Without limiting the preceding sentence, you may not modify, reverse engineer, disassemble, license, transfer, distribute, create works from, or sell the Tool, or use the Tools & Materials to further any commercial purpose.  Without limiting the foregoing, you may not use the Tools & Materials to promote another product or business, or on any site that operates or promotes a server emulator.

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~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Ok I have a serious question now and I would like for paysite owners or those cheering saying EA is going to support paysites to use a little common sense when answering this question.

Did Subway agree to the EULA? Did Disney? Did Gucci? Did McDonalds? Did Donna Race? Did Jessica Galbreth? Did Ruth Moorehead? Did A&F? Christian Dior? Marjolein Bastin? Ralph Lauren? Tommy Hilfiger? Anyone from a whole list of artist, designers, companies owning trademark/copyright? No they did not.

So why on God's green earth would EA open themselves up to lawsuits from any one of these people/companies for actively supporting paysites? If you own one of these companies are you going to sue some tiny website or are you going to go after the people with money? Your going to go after EA and if EA supports paysites, guess who they are going to go after? EA. Especially when they find out that EA is supporting the sale of their copyrighten/trademarked material. So I ask again why would EA support/endorse paysites? Do you seriously think/believe they are willing to jeopordize or take a chance on loosing millions if not billions as the lawsuits pile up to support a few fans? Oh wait you didn't agree to the EULA? Doh, EA may not have some of the brightest bulbs in the package, but no way will they set themselves up for something like that.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2007, 08:11:52 am by PegasusDiana » Logged

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« Reply #233 on: August 15, 2007, 08:10:12 am »

So can we just hug now?Cheesy
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PegasusDiana
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« Reply #234 on: August 15, 2007, 08:13:26 am »

Hey remember I'm with you! I'm one of those that has paid for CC and I don't download from the booty, but I sure love all those pirates and their give em hell attitudes. hehe

Ok HUGSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
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Tenshii~Akari
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« Reply #235 on: August 15, 2007, 09:31:20 am »

:group hu: All is good.  :smile bi:

BtW, I'm not an official pirate... I'm just a guest lurker.  I do support some of what they stand for, especially in telling it like it is, and the pulling together to support free sites.  I really don't care what people decide to do with their games in the long run... I just don't like to see other people get cut off or mistreated for having a reasonable opinion or critique on something.  (...sadly, this happens mostly on paysite forums...)

(Plus, all I care about is having fun with my game and the other simmers in the community.  And whatever I like, I'll put in my game, free or file-shared pay.  Guess I'm just another part time booty-holic now... wait.  That didn't come out right.  :doh:)
« Last Edit: August 15, 2007, 09:36:48 am by Tenshii~Akari » Logged

Inge Jones
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« Reply #236 on: August 16, 2007, 03:48:20 pm »

The terms of use of the EA site was revised on 6th August and now appears to lend more weight to the right of creators not to have their content uploaded to the exchange without permission.   It invites anyone who feels their intellectual property rights have been infringed to contact them and ask - presumably - for that content to be removed.
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SimLogical
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« Reply #237 on: August 16, 2007, 05:02:09 pm »

Quote from: Inge Jones;884613
The terms of use of the EA site was revised on 6th August and now appears to lend more weight to the right of creators not to have their content uploaded to the exchange without permission.   It invites anyone who feels their intellectual property rights have been infringed to contact them and ask - presumably - for that content to be removed.

That sounds fair. I don't know why they didn't do that in the first place.
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Phycosymo
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« Reply #238 on: August 16, 2007, 07:32:03 pm »

Quote from: Inge Jones;884613
The terms of use of the EA site was revised on 6th August and now appears to lend more weight to the right of creators not to have their content uploaded to the exchange without permission. It invites anyone who feels their intellectual property rights have been infringed to contact them and ask - presumably - for that content to be removed.

Sounds just about right...
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Dr_Pixel
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« Reply #239 on: August 18, 2007, 04:41:44 pm »

For those who think the EULA change isn't "official", or only applies to the Content Manager, please see this:
http://bbs.thesims2.ea.com/community/bbs/messages.php?threadID=6134fe0a997bb1d12255fce7195a7cbd&directoryID=2&startRow=1&openItemID=item.2,item.61,item.104,item.41,item.127,item.23#6f4e9dbfcebd6df26b64b9a71d301072
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