Religious faith versus Non-conformist faith and the Sims 2

[Tomkat]

To me it makes no difference having occult-ish characters in the game or not.
I was raised a "christian", but never really caught on to it. But I was always too afraid to let go of it, just in case it really is real and ill go to hell afterwards.

Ive always been interested in cultures and ancient history, Ive even got my own private library of books on the Ancient Romans, Egyptians, Greeks, Maya, Native Americans, Celts etc etc etc. And believe me, Ive read each one.

Interesting fact: All of them existed with strict rules on gods & sacrifice, people LIVED and BREATHED their gods, and even died for the honor of pleasing gods (when necessary). These people were just as fanatic believers as modern day scholars of religions.
They also had hundreds of years of belief.  Fought wars at times etc over it.

Nowadays people seem to think time began only 2000 years ago with the death of JC. When in fact its been going for THOUSANDS of years before that, and even THOUSANDS & MILLIONS of years before humans realized they were "special".  Everyone knows the earth was around for millions and millions of years. So its just weird IMHO to say that any religion is the BE & END ALL of humanity. That sounds like a very human statement to make.

Besides that, who is anyone with a set of beliefs to challenge anyone else's?
What proof do these people have to challenge?

I personally dont believe in a god/devil/heaven/hell. I just cant. Not after everything Ive sucked up. There is just too many different variants.
Besides, if a god is supposed to be flawless, why would he/she create a flawed religion that encourages people to go to war over their belief? That just messed up.

People NEED religion for some reason because they want something to cling to in times of need. The idea of an afterlife is soothing.

Anyways....this is going way-y-y-y-y off topic,
Im not even sure I really made my point clear.
MY OPINION: I dont believe in any specific deity. And i cant believe in a christian god that will condemn the millions of people BC (before christianity) to a hell to suffer eternally just because they had other religions back then before it was "invented".

I think religion is a tool used for the good or bad of society. People find salvation and soothing in it, and others try and exploit that to make those believers do what they want.

[spookymuffin]

I still can't really wrap my mind around someone associating anything from the sims2 with religion... I just don't see the connection.
I was always glad for the fact that there is no religious content in the game, and I still am. Other than the time that I made a cult in my game that worshipped grilled cheese sandwiches that is.

I think religion is a tool used for the good or bad of society. People find salvation and soothing in it, and others try and exploit that to make those believers do what they want.

I agree with you here to a certain degree. Personal faith is something that is usually harmless but I've always felt that organised religions are ticking time-bombs. They can manipulate people into doing some insane crap (murdering "heathens", suicide bombings, male and female circumcision etc)

That is not to say that I condone personal faith either. I am an atheist (read realist) and would prefer for everyone to let go of their security blankets and face reality, but I know that's not going to happen. I know that some people need these things and as long as they keep to themselves about it I'm not going to begrudge them and their childish behaviour.

I have been an atheist ever since I was old enough to think about the concept of religion. I think I was about seven years old and I had just finished reading The Origin of Species by Charles Darwin. I think I remember equating god with Santa at the time; a lie that my parents told me to make a child happy.
I resent the fact that I was baptised as a baby when I was too young to know what was going on, never mind able to make a decision regarding the religion I was being forced into. It still annoys me that on paper I am "catholic" even though I don't believe in their deity. I do believe that just saying "I reject the holy spirit" is supposed to immediately exile you from the religion but the Pope has yet to ring me and tell me that I'm free *shrug*

I think that children should be allowed choose their own religion when they become mature enough to make the decision. Not have their parent's beliefs forced onto them from birth.

[jamesabrown1]

I play my sims a bit like Ancienthighway, religion doesn't really figure into the various games I have going. Sometimes fantasy (elves, and so on), but not formal religion. The closest thing I have to that is a few narcissistic sims on various lots who seem to worship themselves. Anyway, the game is just that, a game. It is escape from the mundane for a while. It is what it is, or rather, what we each make of it. No more, no less.

[Tenshii~Akari]

Admittedly, I have my religion implemented in some way with my sims... mainly in some of my storytelling and such.  (Or at least the stories that're in my head...  :lol:)  But most of the time, when I actually do get a chance to really play, my sims are on their own when it comes to that.  I think they worship each other while having free will more than anything... they don't look it, but those are some lusty little sprites I have, and not with their spouses.  Way to go ACR.  :clap:  

Anyways, I guess if I were someone else of my faith on the outside looking in on the subject of Sims 2 (mainly one of those old church elders or anyone else that's hardcore on believing anything outside of the Lord is "the devil"), I'd think they'd go all sorts of mad with all the claimed "anti-religious" themes and such... they did with just about every controversial video game, Harry Potter, Teletubies, and The Golden Compass, so I wouldn't be surprised if they had something to say about that.  Even though I don't really hold too much interest in the last three, I do think a lot of religious leaders and followers overreacted on the issue... like they fear that people of a religious faith who interact with anything related to those will loose faith in their teachings, and that said people aren't supposed to have an imagination outside of their beliefs without the two conflicting with each other.  Why shouldn't we have an expanded imagination?  I was always taught God made us the way we are for a reason... and if one having a big/outlandish imagination is a sin, then to me it defeats the purpose of being what one is.  But I digress on this one...  :lol:

I think we all know that video games and religion just don't mix well... too wide of a varied audience for the former to add in the latter.  Besides, games are usually just interactive stories/movies made by people who've used their imaginations and skills to bring them to life, and are not supposed to be confused as tools for teaching violence and non-religious practices.  They're just there for us to have fun on the side of RL.  That's how I see it.  

(BTW, thanks for the info, Joy!  And Skeleton... it's scary to me (as a Christian who's not "supposed" to be knowing about them) that the "Satanic Sins" are almost exactly what I'm against.  Not to mention rules 1, 3, 6, 8, and 9 make a good amount of sense, and are almost, "Golden Rule" worthy (but not quite there).  Everything else is just a bit over my head and stuff I don't find "appeasing" to where I stand, especially in the vengeance part... but other than that... wow.  :shock:  It's amazing what you'll learn once you read between the lines.)

[Enayla]

I’m an atheist (in spite of a lot of people, for some reason, assuming I’m not), and I’m not even baptised. I’ve never been drawn to any religion in a profound way – it just doesn’t ‘click’ for me. As for religion in the Sims 2, or the lack thereof, it’s never really factored in – the game is so utterly Politically Correct and it seems they’ve chosen the middle road in every aspect, including religion and sexuality. Something I really like, by the way; for once I’ve not felt like I’ve been overlooked. It seems to me to be pretty much the most open-minded game I can think of.

There’s enough argument about religion in the world without bringing it into a pretty innocent game like Sims 2. It makes me sad to see different groups in uproar over little things like witches or vampires or whatever it might be that got them going – like others have said before me, it’s a game and it’s a cute, nice, friendly, sweet game at that. There are other things to go ballistic over that are far more provoking for one reason or the other without nitpicking on a game that is guilty, at the most, of using fairytale clichés to depict supernatural beings.

I’m personally looking forward to what else they might come up with… unless it’s yet another creature with green skin, hah.

[J00wish]

I just LOVE learning about different religions. Thank you so much for sharing.

Technically the Sims2 game does offer religion as a part of the Happy Holiday SP. I have to admit I was curious about it and bought it this past weekend. I want to see what it allows you to do. I saw the Menorahs but I am not sure if it's just a decoration or you can actually light a candle for each night. I don't mind them having a SP with these add ons and want to even see what happens if I play the Christian part of it. I realize a lot of it is incorrect (tree, actual birth of Christ, etc...) and that these ceremonies were taken from other ones, but they are being used as Christian holidays from what I can tell.

Lael, what's a Shaman?

[EKozski]

Here's a small piece of information. Moderator J00wish/Just Call Me Odessa

[BlackKat13]

I never understood the problem with witches in video games, or stories.  The witches portrayed in games, and folklore are very very different from witches as explained in the bible.  Wicca and paganism is different from this as well.  I saw a fair few girls dressed as witches at my church's Halloween party last year, and I would bet I'll see plenty this year as well.  Plenty of Christians can see the difference.

[shc]

Technically the Sims2 game does offer religion as a part of the Happy Holiday SP. I have to admit I was curious about it and bought it this past weekend. I want to see what it allows you to do. I saw the Menorahs but I am not sure if it's just a decoration or you can actually light a candle for each night. I don't mind them having a SP with these add ons and want to even see what happens if I play the Christian part of it. I realize a lot of it is incorrect (tree, actual birth of Christ, etc...) and that these ceremonies were taken from other ones, but they are being used as Christian holidays from what I can tell.

Honestly, I've never considered the Happy Holiday SP to be particularly religious. Before my family became Wiccan we were one of those families that seems to be the norm of today, did not go to church, somewhat athiestic but still kindof believing in a higher power, cuss using 'oh my god' 'jesus christ' 'jesus mary and joseph' etc etc without it actually meaning anything, and most specifically we still celebrated christmas and easter as well (holloween isn't really celebrated in australia). Alot of people do, even fullblown athiest. These holidays in my belief have transended beyond their religious purpose and have become instead apart of tradition and culture of the western world. Even now that I am wiccan I still give out christmas cards
to my friends and even gifts to the junior members of my family(who are stoked that they get 'xmas' twice a year). And I'm not above getting wasted with my friends at their xmas parties either :wink:

As to religion in the game, as enayla said the game is so politically correct that the thought of doing such never actually occurs to you. I have the Happy Holiday edition of sims 2 and I usually try to give them 'xmas' in seasons midwinter but half the time I forget anway. But to me the xmas thing I try to do isn't about religion it is more about my culture if anything.

In my Medieval hood I have a convent and a monastary, but that wasn't so much trying to add religion in my game but as way of controlling the population in a hood that only has 'try for baby' as an option:D

As to these witches in AL, I actually never saw them as 'wiccan' witches, or even 'satanic' witches for that matter. To me they are more like the witches in such works of fiction like 'The Wizard of Oz'. I even like the fact that if your witch becomes sufficiently evil enough their skin turns green, as a wiccan I would consider it the threefold rule taking effect, afterall karmas a b****. There are some wiccans who consider The Wizard of Oz to be offensive to wiccans/witches. Personally I don't see how, firstly because the witches on the story arent stylised on wiccan witches, and secondly the story also has Glenda the Good Witch which demonstrates in the story that not all witches are bad, which if anything would give witches in general good PR.

[kathy]

See shc this is what I totally relate to with the exception we aren't Wiccan. We have children so naturally we celebrate Christmas, Halloween and Easter. While Eric and myself are both atheist our children are allowed to choose what they believe in. Two of our children are indeed Christians while one isn't. We do not judge our children for their choices.
 
In my game there is no religion. I don't play the way most people play and even if I did my game would remain the same. To echo what Enayla said I like the political correctness of the game that there is a complete middle ground. I do have a religious set that I created for someone else in my folder that sadly has never been put to use.
 

Honestly, I've never considered the Happy Holiday SP to be particularly religious. Before my family became Wiccan we were one of those families that seems to be the norm of today, did not go to church, somewhat athiestic but still kindof believing in a higher power, cuss using 'oh my god' 'jesus christ' 'jesus mary and joseph' etc etc without it actually meaning anything, and most specifically we still celebrated christmas and easter as well (holloween isn't really celebrated in australia). Alot of people do, even fullblown athiest. These holidays in my belief have transended beyond their religious purpose and have become instead apart of tradition and culture of the western world. Even now that I am wiccan I still give out christmas cards
to my friends and even gifts to the junior members of my family(who are stoked that they get 'xmas' twice a year). And I'm not above getting wasted with my friends at their xmas parties either :wink:

[Lael]

Correct me if I am wrong, but the whole issue with witchcraft in the old testament had to do with what witches mainly did back then: communicate with the dead. (Solomon and the Witch of Endor for example)

I can see how god would be somewhat displeased if addressing a soul directly in heaven and that soul suddenly takes a trip downstairs when summoned by a witch. Perhaps even faintly peeved. After all, isn't god supposed to have dominion over heaven? And you have some mortal hauling out people without so much as an 'excuse me, can I borrow so and so?' Makes sense in that context. Now death is a bit harsh, but hey, god wants to discourage such impolite behavior, and that should get people's attention on the matter. Generally, the dead people summoned weren't exactly thrilled either. You get to ultimate bliss and some shmuck hauls you back to the dirt ball you thought you were finally done with for a chat? Talk about rudeness!

It was never directly stated that satan had a thing to do with it. This was purely an ability of an individual and apparently one people were supposed to leave unused. Most old time occult matters dealt mainly with ways and means of manipulating spirits. There is another subtle reason it would be frowned on and encouraged to depart. Shamanism.

Shamanism is one of the oldest spiritual practices on the planet. And it deals mainly with spirits and communication with places other than here. Naturally, if you are founding a religion, you cannot have a local shaman coming along behind you going 'so and so says you're getting it all wrong'. In grand biblical tradition, you put such people to death because they just tend to stick around and continue calling bullshit. Also, people tend to get very caught up with the possibility of communicating with lost loved ones. Takes energy away from worship of a deity, ya know? So, you stick those loved ones in a place of ultimate happiness and tell everyone to leave them alone. Then you come up with a new name for those that practice old ways you are trying to stamp out: witch. Why? Because shaman still had the respect of many long centuries behind them. People would balk at the new rules. With the name change, it made it different enough to slip past people.

Just a thought I had out of the blue. Thought I would share it as mildly interesting as a line of speculation.

[ancienthighway]

Shamanism is one of the oldest spiritual practices on the planet.

Excellant point.  There's evidence of shamans dating back to the Stone Age.  So when you say " you cannot have a local shaman coming along behind you going 'so and so says you're getting it all wrong'", you may just have it backwards.  Shamanism was there first

But it's not just the church that bullied shamanism aside, medical practice did also.  Shaman's were the healers and spiritual leaders of their tribe.  They focused, and still do, on healing mind, body and spirit.  Modern medicine believes in healing the body, controlling the mind and ignoring the spirit.  Modern churches focus on controlling the mind and saving the spirit.  Naturally shamans, to include all the various names for the practice, would be seen as a threat to medicine, which couldn't provide the same results scientifically, and the church, which couldn't accept it's interference with control.

[Lael]

Excellant point.  There's evidence of shamans dating back to the Stone Age.  So when you say " you cannot have a local shaman coming along behind you going 'so and so says you're getting it all wrong'", you may just have it backwards.  Shamanism was there first

I meant the departed were saying it. LOL:happy8: Tongue in cheek, so to speak. Naturally, the person starting an actual religion wouldn't appreciate having the ancestors sticking their departed noses in it, so they would cut off the shaman to shut them up.

[Leah]

OK, I was raised Christian, although I'm Jewish by birth.
I chose to return to the faith of my mothers.

Having said that, you'd expect that my sims are either Christian or Jewish. But they're not.
I simply made up my own Sim Religion for my sims.

To me, my Creator is too high and to holy to be put into a game. But I can't very well play without a religion either - it's a too alien concept to me. Religion is in my heart, in my soul, in my whole being. It makes me who I am and determines my actions.

And on a side note: we have children and don't celebrate christmas, easter or halloween. We do celebrate the Jewish holidays, though. Our children don't feel like they miss out on anything. Actually, they pity other children because they like our holidays infinitely much better.

[CynicalSim]

Actually, Christianity was around long before the birth of Christ.  It is an erroneous thought that it only began then.